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PPAP requirements from suppliers

Discussion in 'IATF 16949:2016 - Automotive Quality Systems' started by S1D3K1CK, Dec 22, 2022.

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  1. S1D3K1CK

    S1D3K1CK Active Member

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    I was recently "voluntold" that in IATF there is a requirement that states, all suppliers shall request PPAP's for all "purchased" processes, Included but not limited to, hardware, purchased components (items or subcomponents to be completed as an assembly), raw material from vendors, basically any process or components used or designed for completing product delivered to the automotive customer(s). If this statement is true, what section in the ISO or IATF standard can this be found? and how should this be approached? Thank you all in advance.
     
    S1D3K1CK, Dec 22, 2022
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  2. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Do you have access to a copy of either standard? ISO 9001 certainly doesn’t state anything of the kind. I’m guessing neither does IATF. But in IATF it will require the flow down of CSRs so it might be inferred. Who told you?
     
    Andy Nichols, Dec 23, 2022
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  3. Jennifer Kirley

    Jennifer Kirley Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't have a copy of the IATF standard in front of me, but I can offer that group will extend an expectation for PPAP for critical parts at least. If the requirement is not in the standard itself, look in the Rules and/or your customer requirements.

    It makes no sense to run a PPAP for every nut and bolt. Criticality is established in Design, but I have noticed the engineers can sometimes get it wrong. You would have to deal with that separately.
     
    Jennifer Kirley, Dec 25, 2022
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  4. John C. Abnet

    John C. Abnet Well-Known Member

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    Goodday @S1D3K1CK
    The short answer is "no". Fortunately (unfortunately ;), I do have 16949:2016 in front of me. There is no reference to PPAP and certainly no specific stipulations you refer to. As @Andy Nichols stated, you must be aware of CSR that may specify such detail, but none that I am aware of.

    Yes, I would also like to know from whom/what/where you received this information?

    Please ensure you have and understand the standard. Likely relevant sections are as follows...
    8.3.4.4
    8.4.2.3 (considerable SI apply to this clause, so please obtain and understand those as well [SI = sanctioned interpretations] ).

    Hope this helps.
    Be well.
     
    John C. Abnet, Dec 26, 2022
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  5. S1D3K1CK

    S1D3K1CK Active Member

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    Thank you all for the input! And none of our customers have CSR's that require this (Or any that we are aware of). I will review these and the standards this week. I was unable to last week because I was away from the office, but I was working with our consultant that helps us prepare for our IATF audits. She stated she has seen this before and has worked with another company that have been hit with a major from this and had trouble closing it. I am almost 100% positive that this is a CSR from their customer that was overlooked or disregarded by the supplier.
     
    S1D3K1CK, Dec 27, 2022
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  6. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    The consultant should also know that such audit “results” are also somewhat dependent on the auditor, what they had for breakfast and sundry other bizarre criteria. Unless you can find a) a requirement and b) have the same auditor, no need to be concerned.
     
    Andy Nichols, Dec 28, 2022
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    S1D3K1CK and RonR Quality Pro like this.
  7. russell nugent

    russell nugent Active Member

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    Sounds strange , from personal experience we use PPAP for bought in components with dimensions or special properties but raw materials we refer to a COC/COA.
     
    russell nugent, Jan 4, 2023
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