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Three processes in the same fishbone and KPI affecting them?

Discussion in 'ISO 9001:2008 - Quality Management Systems' started by Qualmx, May 6, 2017.

  1. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Hello everybody

    I want to share a case I have actually and hope you help me.

    We have ISO 9001 2008.
    Into our system, we have the sales process, production process, and delivery process
    and for them we defined KPI´s, for Sales % of compliment to delivery to client, for Production % compliment of production and for delivery % of late deliveries.

    In a recent management review meeting, the three processes resulted with no compliance
    for the same order (product).

    for that an AC is needed acccording to the system.

    But when doing the AC with (fishbone) separately, Sales results was ok, also Delivery,
    the only with problems was production.

    Because sales and delivery, reviewed their parts and no problem, man,machine, method, etc.
    Is it normal this way? sales and delivery with no problems if KPIS are not in compliance?

    Questions
    1- Will be better to do just one AC including the three processes at the same time, thus having the real results.
    2 It is common to assign those KPIs to sales and delivery if they dont participate directly in the production?

    Please advise.
    Thanks
     
  2. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Adding more information to same problem.
    when I say to do the AC ateh the same time, I mean at developing the fishbone..
    When analyzing man, put in the scenario sales, production and delivery, when analyzing machine, the same, to put in place the three processes and so on..
    until we find the problem according to the process.

    thanks
     
  3. Jennifer Kirley

    Jennifer Kirley Moderator Staff Member

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    For some reason I am having difficulty in understanding what AC means.

    But I do not understand how a fishbone diagram would adequately illustrate three processes. Aren't there unique factors? If so, how would they be identified as to which process they belong?

    Lastly, there is an expectation for each process to have a success metric. That metric would indicate the process's extent of being properly executed. This metric should support higher-level, strategic management goals and objectives.

    It could be possible for metrics to be the same type, for example cycle time. But each process should show its result separately so management can determine where (which process) to focus efforts based on these results.

    Does this make sense?
     
  4. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Thanks
    Sorry,is CA in English (corrective action).
    Well we do a cause and effect analysis with a fishbone when a non conformity is found,in this case the non compliment on goals .
    The problem is that the three processes have a kpi that in someway is related.
    For example sales have to comply with client with a compromise to deliver product ,for that, is a kpi, production has another kpi and delivery process other kpi for delivery on time.
    The point is, in an uncomplinent each process have to do a cause analysis.
    If the analysis is done separately, they may have different root causes.
    That is why I do the question, could the analysis be done with only one fishbone?,putting on every bone the three processes, that way the root cause could be more precise.
    One example, for machine, sales and delivery are ok,but for production is bad,for people,the 3 could be ok, and so on in method ,sales and delivery are ok,but operators in production didnt follow instructions and so on.
    Hope I have explained well.
    Thanks
     
  5. Jennifer Kirley

    Jennifer Kirley Moderator Staff Member

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    Different analyses for different nonconformances will very likely have different root causes, and should have their own fishbone diagrams made to help determine these different root causes.
     
  6. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    You're making things difficult on yourself. It may be that you simply need to correct the situation.
     
    Qualmx likes this.

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