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Is a criminal an interested Party?

Discussion in 'ISO 9001:2015 - Quality Management Systems' started by Dobis, Jun 26, 2020.

  1. Dobis

    Dobis Member

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    Going by the interested party definition in ISO 9000:2015 as "person or organization that can affect, be affected by, or perceive itself to be affected by a decision or activity" of an organisation. Can a criminal be considered as an interested party, especially bank robbers.
     
  2. pkfraser

    pkfraser Member

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    If you read the definition then Yes, but ISO will say that isn't what they meant... Silly, isn't it?
     
  3. Rustle

    Rustle Member

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    As a consultant I find it difficult to review Interested parties with clients without A. Sounding really stupid or B. Patronising the client.
    To keep any chat about this as brief as possible I just supply a list of generic interested parties (which doesn't include criminals) and update this slightly depending on the client & on page 2 of this list I add any specific interested parties and if this was for a bank I suppose they would list robbers. Banks put up signs and share all sorts of information for the benefit of would-be robbers to try and deter them from robbing so in this case they are an interested party.
     
  4. pkfraser

    pkfraser Member

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    How an organisation arranges for security is of interest to a hacker, or a burgler. So criminals are Interested Parties - as are competitors. But that wasn't what ISO intended, I suspect...
     
  5. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Peter, I believe in some cases, they ARE interested parties and, indeed, ISO TC 176 gives guidance to that effect. Not criminals, but competitors. For example, the tobacco industry utilized a "round-robin standard" for smoking machines which tested cigarettes. There is no national/international standard for traceability. Such cases are, however quite rare.

    Criminals as interested parties? Never!
     
  6. pkfraser

    pkfraser Member

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    Andy
    I agree that it is daft, but... “person or organization that can affect, be affected by, or perceive itself to be affected by a decision or activity”.

    First of all, what sort of “decision or activity”? Taken by whom? Surely that needs to be part of the definition? As it stands, the definition is more or less meaningless.

    If an organisation chooses not to lock up its warehouse at night, then a burglar can be affected by that decision, because he can walk in and help himself. Or if it doesn’t implement a firewall or anti-virus software, then its IP (and business) is at risk. That’s what the words mean!
     
  7. RoxaneB

    RoxaneB Moderator Staff Member

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    By the literal word-for-word definition of 'interested party', a criminal could likely be considered in this light. That said, the intent of the standard and its subsequent requirements are all about the ability of the organization to consistently meet the requirements of stakeholders (which would likely NOT include criminals).

    However, an organization may wish to address the conflicting interests where the criminals' interests are at odds with those of a bank's clients. Further to that, the organization may wish to show how they've taken actions to mitigate the likelihood of the criminals successfully achieving their goals and how these actions successfully allow bank clients to achieve their goals.
     
    tony s likes this.
  8. tony s

    tony s Well-Known Member

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    In one organization in my country, once a criminal is put to jail - he/she is an interested party. See its ISO 9001 certification here.:)
     

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