CB Wants to Schedule Two Auditors Onsite for IATF Recertification Audit

So, we are a small company and do not have the staff to support having two auditors on site at one time. Our CB is stating that since the audit is lengthier than usual because of it being a recertification audit, it requires an additional auditor, which we were fine with if the auditors could split the days up. It's a 4.5 day audit, so I didn't think it would be that difficult. They are telling me that per IATF rules that both auditors have to be on site at the same time at least one day. Is this true or are they just trying to get more money from us? I'm looking through their "Rule" book and I don't see anything that refers to this, unless I'm missing something. We have gone through this run-around with them in the past, and were able to get around it but maybe it's because it was a surveillance audit, instead? I don't know but we are the customer and if we tell them we're not able to support two auditors, then they should accommodate us. Anyone else gone through this scenario and have any suggestions on how to handle the situation? At the moment they are not returning my emails or my phone calls after I told them they would have to find a work-around because we have mentioned several times via phone calls that two auditors on site at the same time would not be feasible.

 

Thank you! That's my thought but wanted to get a '2nd opinion', so to speak. I just don't like them dropping this on us at the last minute, which I realize is a strategical move on their part. Hold off as long as possible and then we won't have time to fight back.

 

So we are a small company as well (20-25 people). We have had two auditors do certification audits in the past. It's actually not that bad from a support function and tends to get the audit done quicker. If it's a 4.5 man day audit, they should be out of there in 2.5 days. It's all in the scheduling. We would divide them up to certain departments. So, for example, one would handle purchasing and one manufacturing -- with me available to handle any issues which came. Have they given you the audit schedule yet?

 

No....that won't be available until the quote has been signed off and we still have yet to receive the quote. That will be my next request once quote is signed. Begin pre-audit planning and then request an agenda. Our client representative finally admitted she goofed. With a 4.5 day audit only one auditor will be required but stated that if head count increases, it could increase the amount of audit days. Anything over 5 days will require an additional auditor. Additional auditors don't concern me. Having them both here on the same day, does and not only because of cost but just the simple fact that I am only one person. I have my hands full with one auditor, let alone two. The expectation is that I stay with the auditor at all times and bring in people to be audited, as needed. Our CB has yet to show me in their rule book where it goes against their rules to have the auditors split the days up. It's not an issue now but it does concern me if we happen to go beyond the 5 day audit time frame.

 

Well it's not reasonable to have auditors on different days. They usually come as a team and work the audit till it's done. Why would you want to drag out a two day audit to a whole week. Do you really need to "babysit" your auditees? Drop them off and be available if something comes up. You need a break too, no? I would want to crush my head in a vice if I had to sit in audits for 4+ days straight.

 

Not babysit the auditees, so much as making sure the auditor is escorted for safety reasons, as well as we don't want the auditor just wandering through our plant willy nilly. We don't want them wandering into areas outside of the scope of the audit. Plus, procedures are reviewed prior to being audited so it's just easier for me to have them ready to review, since I am responsible for maintaining them anyway. Plus, a lot of our auditees are on the production floor, and although we prep them beforehand, it's good to be present to make them feel a little less intimidated by the auditor.

 

You don't have managers that can do this? For example, when it is time to audit production I give the auditor to my production manager. He takes him thru the shop and identifies any operators and the like they want to talk to. Nobody is wandering around and if my production manager has a question, I am available to answer.

 

Hi,

It’s not clearing in Rules but IATF have instructed oversights and CB:s that ”split audits” are not allowed. Their definition of a split audit is an audit that takes a break ( for example for a weekend).

If the audit is for more then 5 days you Will need to have 2 auditors on site at the same time.

 

I agree...it's not clear. I can't find anything in the rule book about it and our CB still can't show me where it says that. But in our case, it wouldn't be taking a break. It would be in the same week, but would just have a different auditor come in the remaining days. We have it all straightened out, though. It's pretty much a moot point now because our audit is only 4.5 days, so not sure why she was thinking we would need two auditors. Our employee head count would have to increase significantly for us to reach the 5+ audit day time frame. I really do appreciate everyone's feedback though. It was very insightful!

 

Ahhh...yes. I knew money had to be a factor somehow.

 

I was told by our registrar that an organization has to meet certain criteria to qualify for a virtual audit aka COVID provisions, I believe. If they can't secure an auditor to travel to the facility to perform the audit or if the company was directly affected by COVID. Virtual audits can be a nightmare though. We've been through one for one of our customers and it's just very challenging. When they can't see what's going on out on the floor, you have to stop what you're doing and take pictures of everything and that was just a few elements of the VDA requirements. I can't imagine what a full-blown IATF audit would be like virtually.

 

Oh yeah that portion of the audit would be totally doable for us virtually, as our non-automotive work is very minimal.