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Anyone ever have an auditor do this....????

Discussion in 'ISO 14001:2015 - Environmental Management Systems' started by qmr1976, Mar 7, 2024.

  1. qmr1976

    qmr1976 Well-Known Member

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    We are currently in the midst of our re-certification audit for ISO 14001, and the auditor had pointed out a requirement for management review that was actually an IS-9001 requirement. Can that be referred back to during an ISO 14001 audit? I knew IATF referred back to ISO 9001, but not the environmental side. There was no finding because I pointed out it was referring back to 6.1, which was contingency planning which we do have documented. His issue was I didn't have it documented anywhere that the action items associated with risk analysis were effective after implementation, which I did have evidence of for contingency planning but again...this is specified in ISO 9001 standard. I'm guessing that's why he couldn't write us up? Was I well within my right to challenge this?
     
  2. John C. Abnet

    John C. Abnet Well-Known Member

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    9001 and 14001 mgr review requirements are quite similar. Please state the specific clause/reference you are referring to.
     
  3. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Then, unless you have emulated the ISO 9001 requirements in your EMS, tell them to "keep to the audit criteria and scope"...:mad:
     
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  4. tony s

    tony s Well-Known Member

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    I'm guessing this is related to the requirement in ISO 9001 clause 9.3.2e ("the effectiveness of actions taken to address risks and opportunities (see 6.1)"). The management review clause of ISO 14001 in 9.3b.4 only requires "The management review shall include consideration of: b) changes in: 4) risks and opportunities". Although both mentioned "risks and opportunities", the requirements are not the same.

    If the auditor is looking for evaluation of effectiveness of the actions to address risks/opportunities in your EMS, he/she should refer to ISO 14001 clause 6.1.4b.2 which requires "The organization shall plan: b) how to: 2) evaluate the effectiveness of these actions (see 9.1)".

    If the auditor insists that one of the intention of having a management review is to "ensure effectiveness" and, as output, conclusion on the "continuing effectiveness", the standard is referring to the EMS - not the actions to address risks/opportunities.
     
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  5. qmr1976

    qmr1976 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you all for your comments and insight! We came away from our re-certification audit unscathed! We are low impact when it comes to the environment, but I also challenged the auditor on a few things. As I go through more audits, I get more comfortable with doing this but walking a very fine line of challenging and picking my battles. ;)
     
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