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Pre-audit document and data submission

Discussion in 'IATF 16949:2016 - Automotive Quality Systems' started by John C. Abnet, May 9, 2019.

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  1. John C. Abnet

    John C. Abnet Well-Known Member

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    Good day QFO team;
    I recently became aware of a situation in which the IATF registrar requires a significant amount of documents and information be provided to the registrar in advance of each surveillance (and recert) audit.

    I have attached an example of what one registar is requiring prior to each audit.

    Do any of you that are currently certified to IATF 16949 need to submit a similar amount of information to your registrar prior to each audit?
     

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    John C. Abnet, May 9, 2019
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  2. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    A colleague was assisting a client prepare for IATF 16949 Certification in the first few months of this year and that client had a similar request (maybe not as complex, however). Section 5.7 Audit planning - all audits, 5.7.1 Client information for audit planning (IATF "rules", page 30) lists a - g "stuff" prepared by the client for the CB to prepare.

    It's a worthy practice, IMHO, however, I'm not certain the auditor is compensated for their time and I'm not certain it has a huge impact on the subsequent audit trails developed...(from experience)
     
    Andy Nichols, May 9, 2019
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  3. John C. Abnet

    John C. Abnet Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the feedback @Andy Nichols . I was particularly intrigued (concerned?) that the requirements for the organization included a reference to "rule 5.5". This language (reference to the CB rules) is not generally understood by (not expected to be understood by) the clients.

    Very presumptuous.
     
    John C. Abnet, May 9, 2019
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  4. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    If the CB in question is an IAF-member accredited organization, and have implemented ISO/IEC 7021 using the "ISO 9001" approach, someone needs to look at their "Customer Focus" implementation...;)
     
    Andy Nichols, May 9, 2019
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  5. Jennifer Kirley

    Jennifer Kirley Moderator Staff Member

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    Auditors in my CB are compensated for extra time involved with this (and other) additional documentation, but I have always felt sure it would not be enough.

    as Andy described, 5.7.1 of IATF rules (2017) Client information for audit planning requires pre-audit documentation submission. As with the standard itself, it is advisable for certified organizations to purchase this document and so have access to the rules on their own.

    While it's possible that the CB does not provide an effective communication tool for these document submission requirements, and it's possible the auditor does not communicate effectively, I can offer that I have provided specific step-by-step directions to clients (not IATF) and have them come back to Customer Service and claim they had not been informed.

    And so, not having been present for all this it is difficult to reach valid conclusions.
     
    Jennifer Kirley, May 9, 2019
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  6. John C. Abnet

    John C. Abnet Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for this information Jennifer. Time flies!...I guess it's already been more than 3 years since I've been out of the "industry" . I certainly don't remember such extensive requirements in previous years, but the rules do indeed require most of what this CB is requesting. IATF !!! :eek:
     
    John C. Abnet, May 9, 2019
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  7. Golfman25

    Golfman25 Well-Known Member

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    So that has been a requirement for a number of years now -- since the new rules where released. It's very extensive and for a small company like ours represent the bulk of the audit. You will note item 7 calls for a "process map" even though one isn't required by the standard -- that was a fun one. :)
     
    Golfman25, May 9, 2019
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