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Repeated Major Nonconformances

Discussion in 'IATF 16949:2016 - Automotive Quality Systems' started by SamTFCCI, Apr 15, 2019.

  1. SamTFCCI

    SamTFCCI New Member

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    There is NOT more than corn in Indiana.
    I have always been told by 3rd party auditors that if you have a repeated major nonconformances you could lose your IATF certification.

    Is this rule still in effect for IATF 16949? I can not find it in the rule book.
    If Yes, does the Major Nonconformances follow you for three consecutive years, or only since your last re-certification audit?
     
  2. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Hi Sam: Welcome to QFO.

    The rules under section 8.0 deals with this (page 48) - It talks about ineffective implementation of corrective actions from special visits. In my experience, things have to have deteriorated pretty significantly for this to be the case. Once the major is downgraded to a minor and subsequently "cleared", it's not like points on your driver's licence, and doesn't haunt you (unless the auditors are being biased and have lost objectivity)

    Of course, what it doesn't define is whether the actual CONTENT of the reported non-conformity is worthy of leading to suspension and certificate withdrawal. I've seen some "majors" which, quite frankly, struck me as not even worth being a minor...
     
  3. Jennifer Kirley

    Jennifer Kirley Moderator Staff Member

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    Do yo
    Do you see it in 8.4?
     
  4. SamTFCCI

    SamTFCCI New Member

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    I see in the section of 8.4. "where in corrective actions are not effectively implemented, the audit team shall recommend withdrawal of the certification.

    Since I've never really seen a rule or requirement of how long a major stays at risk for withdrawal I thought I would pose the question. My facility is trying to evaluate our risk of a repeated major. I typically go to the last three audits, but my management was wanting to know if there was something specific.

    I assumed via talks with previous 3rd party auditors that the majors follow you for three years. But I wasn't certain if it was three consecutive years, or since the last recertification audit.
     
  5. johnnymo77

    johnnymo77 Member

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    "Shall" looks ominous.
     
  6. BradM

    BradM Moderator Staff Member

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    Interesting.

    Like Andy alludes to, sadly the spectrum is broad with respect to how the non-conformance is documented and how serious it really is. However... as a customer if I learned that a vendor had the same observed problem over and over and wasn't fixing it, I would be very likely to move my business.
     
  7. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    A major is a major until you provide evidence of action to reduce it to a minor or close it - which is verified at the next scheduled visit (surveillance or "special"). No "following" is done. So, in principle, you can only have a major for a few months. But then, once the situation is revisited, if the action hasn't been effective, the non-conformity is re-instated (or another is written on the CA system) you have another few months to remediate. I guess, if you are on a schedule of "special visits", it would. be the "last 3", but you won't be going the fully certification cycle of 3 years with majors - that would be crazy.
     

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