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How to address contingency actions? 8.2.1

Discussion in 'ISO 9001:2015 - Quality Management Systems' started by Qualmx, Feb 9, 2021.

  1. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    In this case, as a contingency actions, I raised a risk.
    "Not compliment to deliver product to customer on time and right quantity/quality"
    the causes could be because of a fire in the production area.
    I rated the risk, and defined actions to mitigate the risk, but have doubts about
    what a contingency action should include.
    The results if fire ocuurs: equipment damaged, also the infrastructure, in a few words, is not possible
    to start producing in short time.

    My question: Do plans should be focused to continue producing to customer?
    while I rebuild the manufacturing area?
    e.g. Have a contract with other supplier, to have an additional site
    for the production as well as spare equipment?

    or the plans have to be focused to mitigate the risk of fire?
    E.g. to have fire extinguishers ready and in all areas, to ensure there are
    hydrants near and ready, to ensure people can manage fire extinguishers, etc.

    Please feed me back
    also I appreciate if someone could share contingency actions
    at your company.
    Thanks





    8.2.1 Customer communication
    Communication with customers shall include:

    e) establishing specific requirements for contingency actions, when relevant
     
  2. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    I think you have missed the point of the requirement and have gone off on a tangent. But first, are you doing this work alone?
     
  3. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    No, but I'm trying to guide my coworkers.
     
  4. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    OK, I'm always worried when someone says "I'm doing this or that"...

    Let me explain why I believe you are on a tangent. This section is about communicating with customers. Communication which includes e - establishing specific requirements for contingency actions, when relevant.

    My questions to you are:

    Have customers ever requested contingency planning from you? In the event of fire, flood, power loss etc? Is it relevant to your market? If you couldn't deliver for a day while the power went out, would you customer just call and say, OK, what are you doing to get it to me as quickly as possible?

    Launching off on some form of risk analysis, risk rating etc is over blowing (IMHO) a very simple form of communication which is usually what the standard is asking for because it's used in countries where they don't need a sophisticated answer...
     
  5. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Andy

    The customer is asking us the next:
    "what is the contingency plan you have implemented in order to ensure that you always can deliver us the compromised products, in case of a possible contingency?" because we need to complete this requirement into our QMS.

    So in order to fulfill this requirement, I have the idea of raising a risk in this regard and implement action plans to mitigate this risk, altough
    is of very low value.

    Other Idea I have in mind is something I read somewhere, is like this:

    Taken from the net.

    5.2 Where possible Falcon industries, has back up generators to provide emergency power to those processes that could prove to be dangerous or cause serious damage to the machinery if it were to shut down unexpectedly without back up power. Machine controllers are equipped with battery backup to retain program memory.


    5.3 Falcon Industries keeps some spare parts (based on availability and lead time) for all equipment. This is based on the need for the equipment and the impact of extended downtime. As critical replacement parts are identified, maintenance adds them to their inventory of replacement parts.

    etc.

    Normally , we donĀ“t, have problems in delivering products to this customer, neither have risk of flood, what may apply is Power loss or
    fire.

    Even with the Covid Crisis, we could comply the delivery of products at the right time and with quality.

    What would you do in this case?

    Thanks again
     
  6. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    A contingency plan is always a good thing for a business to have, regardless of what a customer asks and what your performance has been historically. Your management team should work with a Business Continuity specialist and jointly develop a plan, because they each need to know how to react and what needs to be done. Once the plan has been developed there should be regular simulations to test what each person should do so they can show they know it. Don't wait until you have an emergency situation to test if everyone knows what to do. You know that small to medium sized companies rarely recover from a significant event, regardless of the cause: Adverse weather, power loss, cyber attack or other. You should consider not just what you do for product, but also protecting your financials too. If you had a cyber attack - one of the more common reasons for having a contingency plan - could you recreate all your records of what your customers business is, your supplier business etc?
     
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  7. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Andy for opening for me the real perspective of contingencies in a business.
    Regards
     
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  8. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Andy, although the simulations only apply for IATF? the mine is 9001.
     
  9. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Having a BCP is nothing to do with what a standard says or not. If you want to do BCS properly, you must do some kind of exercise or simulation. Like a fire drill: How do you know the various training, posters , exit signs, fire doors etc. and fire marshals all work properly? Wait until there's a fire? Look in ISO? No, you do a fire drill to evaluate if the building was evacuated properly and identify where things need improvement BEFORE a fire happens.

    A BCP without an exercise or simulation is dangerous. Nothing to do with ISO vs IATF.
     
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  10. Qualmx

    Qualmx Well-Known Member

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    Yes, perfectly understood.
    Have a good day
     
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