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Preventative v. Corrective Action

Discussion in 'ISO 9001:2015 - Quality Management Systems' started by Scott@jmnspecialties, Feb 1, 2021.

  1. Scott@jmnspecialties

    Scott@jmnspecialties Member

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    Good afternoon all,
    Newbie to ISO and first time poster. When a CAR is needed, how do you know which to issue, a Corrective or Preventative Action?
     
    Scott@jmnspecialties, Feb 1, 2021
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  2. bkirch

    bkirch Active Member

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    I definitely wouldn't call myself an expert, but if you are referring to ISO 9001, I believe requirements for preventive actions went away, and was replaced with risk basked thinking. My company is certified to IATF, and the preventive action requirements remained. In regards to internal auditing, if an issue clearly doesn't meet a requirement such as ISO/IATF, internal, or customer specific requirement it is issued as a finding and requires a corrective action. If there is an issue, that we determine technically meets all required standards, but could become a finding later(not meeting a standard), then we would issue a preventive action request.

    So a corrective action would be required for a finding not meeting a standard. A preventive action would be required to help prevent an issue developing into a finding which would require a corrective action.
     
    bkirch, Feb 1, 2021
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  3. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Welcome Scott! We've all been there.

    For context, since there are few black/white answers, give us more on the reason for the CAR. Audit? Customer complaint?
     
    Andy Nichols, Feb 1, 2021
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  4. Scott@jmnspecialties

    Scott@jmnspecialties Member

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    Thanks for the welcome and thank you both for the replies. I am working with 9001:2015. This instance is not a customer complaint, internal issue. We are a chemical company and produced an order for 11 totes. There were 10 totes with one lot# and 1 tote with a different lot#. The shipping guy filled out his paperwork with 11 totes of the 1 lot#. this cause confusion when billing went to select the lots since there was only one on the shipping paperwork and 2 different ones in the inventory. Operation manager sent me the info and asked me to do the CAR.
     
    Scott@jmnspecialties, Feb 1, 2021
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  5. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    I'd suggest that, depending on how often this happens, a CAR isn't the right way to go. It can simply be recorded as a non-conformity and any actions necessary to correct the paperwork. A CAR should be taken in response to those issues where there's been a trend of such types of error. What's the history of doing such things?
     
    Andy Nichols, Feb 1, 2021
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  6. tony s

    tony s Well-Known Member

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    Corrective action is intended for nonconformities that already happened, while preventive action are for those that are potential to happen. CA prevents recurrence, while PA prevents occurrence. There's also another type of action that is called "correction". This is intended for just fixing the problem, not its cause. CA is more demanding than correction since CA is intended to address the cause of the problem.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
    tony s, Feb 2, 2021
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  7. Rustle

    Rustle Member

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    just call it a problems form ;)
     
    Rustle, Feb 2, 2021
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  8. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    What it's called doesn't do anything to assist the actions which are required to address the issue. He's got 3 options: Correction, Corrective Action and Preventive Action.
     
    Andy Nichols, Feb 2, 2021
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  9. Rustle

    Rustle Member

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    * and make sure your problems form includes containment, corrective and preventative action
     
    Rustle, Feb 4, 2021
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  10. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    It's called an "8 D"
     
    Andy Nichols, Feb 4, 2021
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    Bev D likes this.
  11. Scott@jmnspecialties

    Scott@jmnspecialties Member

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    Thanks to all for the advise. It is very informative and helpful. Looking forward to getting advise on my future hurdles.
     
    Scott@jmnspecialties, Feb 19, 2021
    #11