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Exterior Supplier Question

Discussion in 'ISO 9001:2015 - Quality Management Systems' started by Bruce Brannon, Dec 29, 2020.

  1. Bruce Brannon

    Bruce Brannon Member

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    We are a new business (in the USA), and are in the process of writing processes and procedures. We are planning to have an exterior supplier provide a completed item to us, as follows:

    A: We have suppliers drop-ship materials to exterior contractor
    B: Supplier assembles/packages item
    C:We ship completed items

    Questions:
    1 - If supplier is ISO 9001:2015 qualified, what portion of a procedure (if any) must we provide documentation for?
    2 - If supplier is not, then I can quality them as a department, and at that time i must provide procudures and auditing documentation/history, correct?

    Thanks in advance!
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2020
    Bruce Brannon, Dec 29, 2020
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  2. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    Good questions, Bruce!

    A1 - it depends on what kinds of things you're asking them to furnish in terms of documentation. You only have to have procedures that are a) within your scope and b) your organization has decided it needs procedures for.

    A2 - If the supplier doesn't have a QMS (at least a certified one) you a) cannot treat them as an internal department (because they aren't) and b) you have to determine what kinds of controls they have appropriate to what they are going to do for you. If they are doing all the work and you simply ship the stuff, it seems that there's potentially a significant amount of risk whether ISO certified or not.
     
    Andy Nichols, Dec 29, 2020
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  3. Bruce Brannon

    Bruce Brannon Member

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    We have two possible ship points. One is an exterior supplier that is ISO, one is not. Thanks!
     
    Bruce Brannon, Dec 29, 2020
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  4. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    You have to put in controls which help you manage the risk of the supplier screwing up. It's not really based on being ISO certified - I've seen some toe-curlingly bad (ANAB-accredited) ISO 9001:2015 Certificates recently. It's about the controls the supplier has or is prepared to put in place, based on what you want.
     
    Andy Nichols, Dec 29, 2020
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  5. Jennifer Kirley

    Jennifer Kirley Moderator Staff Member

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    I have a supplier doing the exact same thing. It works great until boxes with damaged parts start showing up at installation sites. The fact is, the organization that sub-contracts processes is still overall responsible for the quality of goods and/or services provided. Sure, they can all be individually ISO 9001 certified, but even the best of those CB auditors are only on site for a few days out of the year so the risk of relying only on that is still high.

    The contracting organization is expected to control suppliers. My supplier has not yet visited their contractor, so that is next on their list so they can get a look (even for one day) at incoming parts quality, handling during picking and packaging, and the warehousing & shipping processes. Maybe more than one visit would be needed.

    I hope this helps!
     
    Jennifer Kirley, Dec 31, 2020
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  6. Bruce Brannon

    Bruce Brannon Member

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    OK I revisiting this earlier response, as follows:


    A1 - it depends on what kinds of things you're asking them to furnish in terms of documentation. You only have to have procedures that are a) within your scope and b) your organization has decided it needs procedures for.

    OK so basically my scope is going to be:
    1 - Documenting logging Customer Inquiry Process
    2 - Documenting creating a Workorder to fulfill Customer Inquiry
    3 - Documenting Producing PO's to get raw materials to external supplier/contractor
    4 - Document auditing process

    Is there anything I'm missing?
     
    Bruce Brannon, Jan 12, 2021
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  7. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    If you are asking in the context of also complying with ISO 9001:2015 at the same time, then yes, very probably you're missing quite a bit more. But, to be honest, I'm not understanding your question(s). Let me also revisit your scenario:

    My first questions are "Why are you doing this? What's the goal?"
     
    Andy Nichols, Jan 12, 2021
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  8. Bruce Brannon

    Bruce Brannon Member

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    Need to get ISO certification. Our product will go on vehicles, mostly heavy-truck market. Some of our customers want us to be ISO 9001:2015 certified, hence the questions
     
    Bruce Brannon, Jan 12, 2021
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  9. Andy Nichols

    Andy Nichols Moderator Staff Member

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    OK, good, now I understand a lot more and others will chip in their perspectives, too.

    The above list is short by quite a bit. Do you have a copy of the ISO 9001:2015 standard? If not, get one and also buy ISO/TS 9002. If you think there are expensive, try doing this without them (as the old story goes)!

    If you are in the sunshine state(s) of the SE, you may well be able to tap into some grant funding to get someone in to help you, instead of iteratively posting questions here because they will likely result in very long and hence, confusing answers. There are few straightforward answers when it comes to doing all things "ISO". I can provide details of someone to contact in your state to get you some basic help, if you wish.
     
    Andy Nichols, Jan 12, 2021
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